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The Gods of Liberalism Revisited


The lie hasn't changed, and we still fall for it as easily as ever.  But how can we escape the snare?



Wednesday, November 19, 2008

Zogby Releases Poll, Statement on How Obama Got Elected

Yesterday quite a few Barack Obama voters--the more cognizant ones, that is--were upset to hear about the video made by John Ziegler of questions being asked of clueless Obama voters after they had come out of the voting booth.

While almost every one could answer questions about the slurs the media and other liberals made against Sarah Palin, almost none could answer correctly concerning genuine gaffes made by Barack Obama and Joe Biden. They also could not answer basic facts concerning the candidates they had just voted for.

A quick summary of results from a Zogby poll which found stunning levels of ignorance on the part of Obama voters was also released.

This display of numbing ignorance was of course met with howls of disapproval and quick efforts to obfuscate and undermine credibility by liberals. In fact, the Daily Kos (the place where many liberals receive their daily talking papers) hit this one quickly and got out the standard denial-track overnight Monday night.

So it was that yesterday liberals parroted the "push polling, push polling" mantra fed to them by the Daily Kos.

It didn't matter how many times you explained to them why this the video and the Zogby poll were not push polling (primarily that it was done after the election where it could not do what push polls are designed to do: push the voter toward voting for a particular candidate based on negative information or insinuation). These liberals had been fed the "push polling" line, that was all they had, and they were going to use it like brave little soldiers.

Perhaps they'll believe Zogby International itself (there I go, getting optimistic again). John Zogby of Zogby International is himself a Democrat, so there are no reasonable (notice I said "reasonable") grounds for charges of Right-wing bias here).

Zogby has not only released the full results of the poll, but has also placed a statement on their website specifically to answer these mindless charges of "push polling."

Zogby says

"We stand by the results our survey work on behalf of John Ziegler, as we stand by all of our work. We reject the notion that this was a push poll because it very simply wasn't. It was a legitimate effort to test the knowledge of voters who cast ballots for Barack Obama in the Nov. 4 election. Push polls are a malicious effort to sway public opinion one way or the other, while message and knowledge testing is quite another effort of public opinion research that is legitimate inquiry and has value in the public square. In this case, the respondents were given a full range of responses and were not pressured or influenced to respond in one way or another. This poll was not designed to hurt anyone, which is obvious as it was conducted after the election. The client is free to draw his own conclusions about the research, as are bloggers and other members of society. But Zogby International is a neutral party in this matter. We were hired to test public opinion on a particular subject and with no ax to grind, that's exactly what we did. We don't have to agree or disagree with the questions, we simply ask them and provide the client with a fair and accurate set of data reflecting public opinion." - John Zogby

Here are some of the results of the poll:
97.1% High School Graduate or higher, 55% College Graduates

Results to 12 simple Multiple Choice Questions

57.4% could NOT correctly say which party controls congress (50/50 shot just by guessing)

81.8% could NOT correctly say Joe Biden quit a previous campaign because of plagiarism (25% chance by guessing)

82.6% could NOT correctly say that Barack Obama won his first election by getting opponents kicked off the ballot (25% chance by guessing)

88.4% could NOT correctly say that Obama said his policies would likely bankrupt the coal industry and make energy rates skyrocket (25% chance by guessing)

56.1% could NOT correctly say Obama started his political career at the home of two former members of the Weather Underground (25% chance by guessing).

As I told one persistent liberal yesterday, even if it had been a push poll, that does not alter the most important aspects of the exercise: that these facts about Barack Obama and Joe Biden were true, and that Obama voters were utterly clueless about the facts.

I admitted up front yesterday that not all Obama voters are clueless. Many are sincere, dedicated socialists who knew exactly the kind of un-American candidate they were supporting (un-American in that Obama espouses values antithetical to Americanism and how America was designed to work).

But a large number of average Obama voters--as evidenced by this video and the Zogby poll--simply knew very little about the candidates. They had swallowed the propaganda fed them by the "mainstream" media. As evidenced by the video, that propaganda said that John McCain was a mean old guy, Sarah Palin was a mean idiot, and that there was nothing negative about Obama or Biden.

First and foremost, it is every person's responsibility to educate and inform themselves. Our right to vote is a sacred and very important thing; it should not be exercised indiscriminately and without good information.

But our journalistic corps' job is to provide objective facts, not spin and propaganda which favors the candidate they favor (and polls also show that the "mainstream" media overwhelmingly supported Obama and other Democrats). Our media bills itself as being "unbiased" an "objective." Those things are essential to the health of a representative democracy.

But we do not have "truth in advertising" from our "mainstream" media. We have snake oil. And the deleterious of that poison the media sells was evidenced in this video.

I strongly suspect that on election day, ignorance carried the day.


Dr. Theo said...

I appreciate the work that Ziegler and Zogby have done but I fear the Obama supporters will only reject the findings and most conservatives could have easily predicted the results of such a poll beforehand.

The MSM failed Americans in their role as guardians of the truth, but the Republican Party also failed us in not aggressively educating the public of the truth. I wish McCain or Palin (in fairness, she was restrained by the campaign) would have brought up the economic crisis in every speech and interview and driven home the truth about how democrats had abused the sub-prime lending system to their financial and political advantage. Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, Pelosi, Reid and Obama should have been named daily for their roles in the collapse of Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac. Our economic mess is a direct result of Democrat's incompetence and greed.

It is frightening to realize how easily the electorate can be manipulated in this country. I have often wondered how Germans could have supported a leader like Adolf Hitler. I am beginning to understand.

Shap said...

I agree with this poll. Voters need to LEARN and MEMORIZE right-wing talking points! Otherwise, they should not be allowed to vote.

We should round up all the liberals in this country and force them to listen to Rush and Hannity, until they can repeat word-for-word all of their talking points. Once these libs are INFORMED of the TRUTH, they will see that their Messiah and savior is just a common street-thug who pals around with terrorists and anti-semites, and listens to 'gangsta' rap music.

Dr. Theo said...

Right-wing talking points?! Do you mean like "what party controls the Congress? Or who is Nancy Pelosi? Barney Frank? Harry Reid? (These names are particularly germane as they played such major roles in the economic collapse.)

The fact that the interviewees all knew the Palin negatives, mostly created from whole cloth by the Obama campaign and obediently repeated over and over by the MSM, is an indictment of the media more than anything.

I don't think "talking points" were the issue here. It was simply a matter of the media controlling the flow of information in a successful attempt to influence the outcome of a national election. This effort was coordinated and paid for by mostly faceless, powerful and ruthless backroom bosses. In fact, this campaign and this candidate are perfect examples of Chicago mob politics.

Colin said...

For anyone interested, the full results of this push poll are available at:


One could read this and form his own opinions about the qualitative nature of the questions (especially the grammatical errors) and what the results actually indicate.

Guy Smylie said...

It's good to get it on tape. Even if they won't believe it.

I don't know what's wrong with asking 'how does one start their political career the home of an admitted terrorist by accident, and is still able to get away with doing so?'
'How can you attend a church preaching defeatism and win two major elections with almost no experience?'

I guess as soon as we start thinking; we start hating! And it's soo easy to memorize things when they make sense and are backed up with facts.

Bob Ellis said...

Did you bother to even read this post, Colin, or did you just see the headline and decide you needed to embarrass yourself with another ignorant comment?

This link is in the body of the post.

As for the "grammatical errors," remember: they were questioning Obama voters here. They probably surmised that proper grammar would render meaningful communication impossible.

And as I exhaustively tried to explain to you yesterday--and as Zogby explained both in this post and on his website--this was NOT a push poll.

You really ARE a typical Obama voter, aren't you?

Colin said...

Why do you need to be such a pompous ass, Bob!? WHY!? Your rudeness astounds me. I simply hadn't noticed that you'd included the link to the complete results of this push poll.

You're an angry man. A simple, angry man. Doesn't your faith bring you any solace or comfort?

I'm not a typical Obama voter, my friend. I'm far, far left of that, and I'm much smarter than the average bear.

What's amazing, though, is that with my education and experience, I'll readily admit that I'm not always right; I don't know everything. I spend my life learning MORE, not calling others names and convincing myself that I'm right. I spend my life empowering others. I spend my life loving others.

That, for example, is why I read your site, and when I comment with questions, I USUALLY am seeking insight from you. I want to understand what the bases for your opinions are, what the logic is, and what drives this "thing" you got going.

I will point out flaws when I see them, but you're never willing to give. You almost never answer the posited question; you just derail the conversation. You'd rather attack me, someone you DON'T know. You know nothing of me other than that I post comments on your website. I'm a complex human being with various views on subjects, but you're only interested in pigeonholing me. What insight does that provide? Do you think I pigeonhole you? Do I merely insult you?

Bob Ellis said...

You liberals are so predictable, Colin. When you get caught in your poor behavior, you always play the victim card.

I think it's quite clear that you came to my website playing the know-it-all...and when I repeatedly, over and over demonstrate that you just don't know what you're talking about, it's time for the "Boo hoo" and "Humble little me" routine. And if you're at all sincere about your claim that when you ask questions of me you're looking for insight, why don't you try not coming onto my website and stomping around like you know everything?

Seriously, though. If you had bothered to read the piece, you'd have seen the link...and Zogby's statement explaining push polls. But that's your problem. Like the typical Obama voter, you build your little liberal world on headlines and sound bites and never look at anything deeper.

When I encounter a deficiency in my knowledge, it shames me and motivates me to learn more. Most liberals don't even seem to notice that they don't understand something...or they're too ashamed to face it, so they just fall back on talking points and ignore it.

If nothing else, and if there's a grain of sincerity in what you've said, I hope this can motivate you to stop relying on what the "mainstream" media and the Daily Kos feeds you and start looking for real truth.

Colin said...

I am sincere. I did read what Zogby had to say, and perceived it to be self-serving nonsense.

I ask questions. I probe what I perceive to be holes in your arguments. That's not stomping, Bob. That's commenting and questioning.

But again, read your own last post. No less than four attempts to pigeonhole me.

I repeat: "What insight does that provide? Do you think I pigeonhole you? Do I merely insult you?"

I ask again: "Doesn't your faith bring you any solace or comfort?" Do you enjoy attacking people? Does it fire you up to put someone else down?

You'll never answer any of these questions because THAT would require real introspection and a little bit of empathy. It would require that you diverge from YOUR talking points.

I am sincere. I'm no victim. I'm a human being. Have a good night, man.

Bob Ellis said...

Okay, Colin, I'll humor you.

What you call "pigeonholing" I call "calling a spade a spade" and "correct identification." It's based on many years of personal and professional human observation.

And if I seriously thought you were interested in insight or learning something, I would answer in a different manner. But your attitude from the git-go has demonstrated you're only interested in stomping around in an attempt to dilute or undermine any truth from getting out in this liberal-media-dominated world we live in.

And yes, my faith brings me great comfort and solace. I remember what it was like when I had none, and it brings me great comfort. I don't enjoy attacking people...but I don't enjoy it when liberals attack everything I believe in, everything decent, and everything that has made our country great. And I absolutely will not stand for it.

Just as nature abhors a vacuum, so lies rush in to fill a void of truth. So many good people have been intimidated by the Left that they sit on their hands and keep their mouths shut...and too many people take that silence for agreement with the lies.

Well, the buck stops here. When I stand before God, I don't want him asking me, "Why didn't you be the salt and light I told you to be? Why didn't you address any of those life-killing and soul-killing lies going around out there?"

And with His help, He'll have no cause to ask me that.

Colin said...

Now that seems a sincere answer.

Thanks for continuing to post my comments, Bob.

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